Powys-Lybbe Forbears - Person Sheet
Powys-Lybbe Forbears - Person Sheet
NameJohn Whitehouse 
[3], [4, 1961 ref: RG09, piece 1982, folio 97, p. 15], [4, 1871 ref: RG10, piece 2925, folio 68, p. 23], [4, 1881 ref: RG11, piece 2786, folio 40, Page 9]
[3], [4, 1961 ref: RG09, piece 1982, folio 97, p. 15], [4, 1871 ref: RG10, piece 2925, folio 68, p. 23], [4, 1881 ref: RG11, piece 2786, folio 40, Page 9]Birthca 1844, Cheslyn Hay, Staffs
Deathaft 1901
GeneralCoal miner.
FatherWilliam Whitehouse (1822-)
MotherSusannah Hodgkiss (1822-)
Spouses
1Emma Eccleston [19, The baptism of her son William Henry Eccleston on 30th April 1865 in Cannock], [19, The baptism of her son George Whitehouse on 30th April 1865 in Cannock], [4, 1871 ref: RG10, piece 2925, folio 68, p. 23], [4, 1881 ref: RG11, piece 2786, folio 40, Page 9], [4, 1891 ref: RG12, piece 2221, folio 142, p. 12], [4, 1901 ref: RG13, piece 2665, folio 7, p. 6]
[19, The baptism of her son William Henry Eccleston on 30th April 1865 in Cannock], [19, The baptism of her son George Whitehouse on 30th April 1865 in Cannock], [4, 1871 ref: RG10, piece 2925, folio 68, p. 23], [4, 1881 ref: RG11, piece 2786, folio 40, Page 9], [4, 1891 ref: RG12, piece 2221, folio 142, p. 12], [4, 1901 ref: RG13, piece 2665, folio 7, p. 6]Marriage20 Feb 1865, St Matthew’s Church, Walsall, Staffs
ChildrenGeorge (ca1865-)
Susannah (1868-ca1946)
Eliza (ca1872-)
Josiah (ca1874-ca1939)
<not named> (ca1875-ca1875)
Frederick (ca1876-)
John Henry (ca1879-)
Emily Maud (ca1881-)
Samuel Francis (ca1884-)
Notes for John Whitehouse
He gave a few different birth years in the censuses and at marriage:
Census Birth Birth place
1865 1842 -
1871 1841 Cheslyn Hay
1881 1844 Cheslyn Hay
1891 1847 Cheslyn Hay
1901 1844 Cheslyn Hay
There are far too many John Whitehouse births within 1841 to 1847 to identify his.
There were thirty four John Whitehouse deaths in Staffordshire from 1901 to 1941.
He was last seen in the 1901 census so must have died any time after that.
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At marriage he gave his father’s name as William and said he was a coal miner.
Can I find a Cheslyn Hay family in 1961 with him and his father William both in the one dwelling?
In 1961, here’s one candidate at Wyrley Bank, Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire:
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William Whitehouse Head M M 39 1822 Coal miner Great Wyrley, Staffordshire
Susannah Whitehouse Wife M F 39 1822 - Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
John Whitehouse Son U M 19 1842 Coal miner Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Samuel Whitehouse Son U M 16 1845 Coal miner Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Jonah Whitehouse Son U M 12 1849 Brick burner Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Selina Whitehouse Daur U F 10 1851 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Louisa Whitehouse Daur U F 8 1853 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Eliza Whitehouse Daur - F 7 1854 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Mary Ann Whitehouse Daur - F 4 1857 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
William Whitehouse Son - M 2 1859 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Frederick George Whitehouse Son - M 0 1861 - Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Ref:
Archive reference RG09
Piece number 1982
Folio 97
Page 15
Combined: 1961 ref: RG09, piece 1982, folio 97, p. 15
The other John Whitehouse family with a William in the house had the William for a brother, not a father. So the above is the most likely for John Whitehouse’s family in 1961.
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Census Birth Birth place
1865 1842 -
1871 1841 Cheslyn Hay
1881 1844 Cheslyn Hay
1891 1847 Cheslyn Hay
1901 1844 Cheslyn Hay
There are far too many John Whitehouse births within 1841 to 1847 to identify his.
There were thirty four John Whitehouse deaths in Staffordshire from 1901 to 1941.
He was last seen in the 1901 census so must have died any time after that.
_____________________
At marriage he gave his father’s name as William and said he was a coal miner.
Can I find a Cheslyn Hay family in 1961 with him and his father William both in the one dwelling?
In 1961, here’s one candidate at Wyrley Bank, Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire:
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
William Whitehouse Head M M 39 1822 Coal miner Great Wyrley, Staffordshire
Susannah Whitehouse Wife M F 39 1822 - Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
John Whitehouse Son U M 19 1842 Coal miner Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Samuel Whitehouse Son U M 16 1845 Coal miner Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Jonah Whitehouse Son U M 12 1849 Brick burner Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Selina Whitehouse Daur U F 10 1851 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Louisa Whitehouse Daur U F 8 1853 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Eliza Whitehouse Daur - F 7 1854 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Mary Ann Whitehouse Daur - F 4 1857 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
William Whitehouse Son - M 2 1859 Scholar Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Frederick George Whitehouse Son - M 0 1861 - Cheslyn Hay, Staffordshire
Ref:
Archive reference RG09
Piece number 1982
Folio 97
Page 15
Combined: 1961 ref: RG09, piece 1982, folio 97, p. 15
The other John Whitehouse family with a William in the house had the William for a brother, not a father. So the above is the most likely for John Whitehouse’s family in 1961.
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Notes for John & Emma (Family)
Their marriage index:
First name(s) Emma
Last name Eccleston
Marriage quarter 1
Marriage year 1865
MarriageFinder Emma Eccleston married one of these people
John Whitehouse, George Acres
District Walsall
County Staffordshire
Country England
Volume 6B
Page number 702
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005
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This does not provide the names of their fathers. Nor can a copy of any parish register marriage be found on FindMyPast. So I may have to shell out on a full marriage Certificate. Though Ancestry will be tried first; they have nothing. Ordered from GRO on 6 July 2021. Delivered on 13th July 2021.
______________________
One point to notice is that all her and John Whitehouse’s children were registered with her maiden name given as Eccleston. It is not clear yet what even was the first event to have this maiden name reported. Was it the marriage on 20th February 1865 or was it the registration of George’s birth in Q1 of 1965? I have ordered George’s birth certificate to find out; on 13th July 2021.
The next event at which her maiden name of Eccleston was given was in April 1865 when she got her first two children baptised and gave her full maiden name for the sole parent of William Henry whose birth had not been registered. See the marriage notes for the relationship between herself and the unknown father of William Henry Eccleston.
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Walsall where they married, is about seven miles from Cheslyn Hay where they lived and where all the children were born. Why did they go there and how did they do it?
She married in Q1 of 1865; she gave birth to George in Q1 of 1865. I will shortly get the precise date of their marriage and the precise date of George’s birth is looking necessary.
So whatever the date, she was either heavily pregnant or had just given birth. Could she really have walked that distance? There were no buses or trains in those days and probably she and John could not have afforded either of those. They may have got a lift on a carter’s wagon.
This still does not explain the long journey. It is looking extremely likely that Emma was a very young mother. She could have given birth to William Henry as young as ten. If she wished to get married at the age of eleven, she would have needed her father’s permission. She might have been thrown out of her parents’ house the moment she announced her pregnancy. Or she might have anticipated a veto on her marriage by her father. Anyhow she could well have needed to conceal her age and make out that she was 21; certainly she did something of the sort in the early censuses of her married life.
(My gt-grandfather said his father was dead when he got married at the age of 19; this saved him the trouble of getting the long-estranged chap’s permission for his first marriage. And in fact he later died some nine years before his father.)
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Transcript of the marriage certificate:
CERTIFIED COPY OF AN ENTRY OF MARRIAGE GIVEN AT THE GENERAL REGISTER OFFICE
1865 Marriage solemnised at St Matthew’s Church in the Parish of Walsall in the County of Stafford
No: 346
When Married: February 20th
His Hers
Full name: John Whitehouse Emma Eccleston
Age: 23 20
Condition: Bachelor Spinster
Profession: Miner -
Residence: Lichfield St. Lichfield St.
Father’s name: William Whitehouse William Eccleston
Father’s job: Miner Forgeman
Married in the Parish Church according to the Rites and
Ceremonies of the Established Church by Banns by me: Wm. Burnet, Curate
This Marriage was solemnized between us: X John Whitehouse his mark, Emma Eccleston
In the Presence of us: X Joseph Jones his mark, X Elizabeth Morgan her mark.
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First name(s) Emma
Last name Eccleston
Marriage quarter 1
Marriage year 1865
MarriageFinder Emma Eccleston married one of these people
John Whitehouse, George Acres
District Walsall
County Staffordshire
Country England
Volume 6B
Page number 702
Record set England & Wales Marriages 1837-2005
______________________
This does not provide the names of their fathers. Nor can a copy of any parish register marriage be found on FindMyPast. So I may have to shell out on a full marriage Certificate. Though Ancestry will be tried first; they have nothing. Ordered from GRO on 6 July 2021. Delivered on 13th July 2021.
______________________
One point to notice is that all her and John Whitehouse’s children were registered with her maiden name given as Eccleston. It is not clear yet what even was the first event to have this maiden name reported. Was it the marriage on 20th February 1865 or was it the registration of George’s birth in Q1 of 1965? I have ordered George’s birth certificate to find out; on 13th July 2021.
The next event at which her maiden name of Eccleston was given was in April 1865 when she got her first two children baptised and gave her full maiden name for the sole parent of William Henry whose birth had not been registered. See the marriage notes for the relationship between herself and the unknown father of William Henry Eccleston.
__________________
Walsall where they married, is about seven miles from Cheslyn Hay where they lived and where all the children were born. Why did they go there and how did they do it?
She married in Q1 of 1865; she gave birth to George in Q1 of 1865. I will shortly get the precise date of their marriage and the precise date of George’s birth is looking necessary.
So whatever the date, she was either heavily pregnant or had just given birth. Could she really have walked that distance? There were no buses or trains in those days and probably she and John could not have afforded either of those. They may have got a lift on a carter’s wagon.
This still does not explain the long journey. It is looking extremely likely that Emma was a very young mother. She could have given birth to William Henry as young as ten. If she wished to get married at the age of eleven, she would have needed her father’s permission. She might have been thrown out of her parents’ house the moment she announced her pregnancy. Or she might have anticipated a veto on her marriage by her father. Anyhow she could well have needed to conceal her age and make out that she was 21; certainly she did something of the sort in the early censuses of her married life.
(My gt-grandfather said his father was dead when he got married at the age of 19; this saved him the trouble of getting the long-estranged chap’s permission for his first marriage. And in fact he later died some nine years before his father.)
______________________
Transcript of the marriage certificate:
CERTIFIED COPY OF AN ENTRY OF MARRIAGE GIVEN AT THE GENERAL REGISTER OFFICE
1865 Marriage solemnised at St Matthew’s Church in the Parish of Walsall in the County of Stafford
No: 346
When Married: February 20th
His Hers
Full name: John Whitehouse Emma Eccleston
Age: 23 20
Condition: Bachelor Spinster
Profession: Miner -
Residence: Lichfield St. Lichfield St.
Father’s name: William Whitehouse William Eccleston
Father’s job: Miner Forgeman
Married in the Parish Church according to the Rites and
Ceremonies of the Established Church by Banns by me: Wm. Burnet, Curate
This Marriage was solemnized between us: X John Whitehouse his mark, Emma Eccleston
In the Presence of us: X Joseph Jones his mark, X Elizabeth Morgan her mark.
______________________